budgie

Still no answer to my "jim clarke" cars question, and about some of his re-shelled cars.
and how dealers are making vast profits from re-shells.
find a wreck mk 1 lotus if you can find one £5000 or more
how much a good shell ? £2000
engine/mechanical rebuild £5000.
body/resto £8000
thats £20,000 for a mint re-shell.
so if a cheap one comes up, and no one on here will tell me what to look for, i stand a chance of missing a car waiting for your guys to inspect for me.
when its cheap,you have to move fast .
So what the secret?
what do i look for?
you are not helping,by not telling, as you said this club is to help people in buying a car,and i would not want to let on if i found a cheap lotus mk 1.
so how much was the shells strenghthened, and where to look, apart from rear chassis legs.
please advise...thx
 
What you state is hypothetical.
Which car is it that you are looking at in such a hurry?

You can put your own list together like I did. You can speak to Andy or Rick on the phone. You can get a local area person to come with you.
You can be patient and wait for a car on this site. You can get a full inspection etc.etc.

There would appear to be more people wanting genuine cars than are available, so common sense suggests its a waiting game and a bit of luck.

Anything rushed is a bad idea,esspecially just because its cheap.

If you want a car quickly buy a reshell or somethong else.

Regards,
FH
 
Body resto £8000, you must be joking with wings at £1500 the pair etc etc that would hardly buy the panels. My body resto cost more than that 10 years ago with the paintjob alone £3000 plus £600 materials.
Problem is for a trader, they can't afford to do it right, that way you don't make money. Make it look right, for long enough that it won't come back, is all that matters. Genuine enthusiasts will spend what's needed to do the job right.
Tommy
P.S. IF a works car was reshelled by lotus/ford when these cars were active comp cars then thats fine. Still a works car built by the works and still entitled to it's identity.
 
The problem with Lotus Cortinas is inelastic supply and increasing demand.

When demand is low in effect, the price will be low. When demand is high , the price will be high. However since only so many were produced the quantity is always fixed, any shifts in demand will only affect price.

Thats where reshells creep in, falsely boosting the supply, and claiming (or attempting to ) real example money. And its easy as the cars are a derivative of one of Fords most popular cars.
The inelastic supply of cars make them worth faking today. Some as you say will have been reshelled inocently in the 70's along with other mods (Seats & wheels).

I remember gas axing my elan sprint chassis for a new galvanised one in the 80's, and changing the colour. Felt like the right idea at the time,as did the retrim,rose jointed suspension, vegantune engine etc, but now frowned upon.
 
428 lost the plot a little bit,really dont care about yanks,this is about mk1,mkk2 lotus cortinas,that are the real deal,if wanted to by a 69/rs camero nos matching i would join the club,why,cause i cant tell a good one from a bad un.
Bottom line again,sell it for what it is,?????
 
By the way 428, there's less special about a mk2 lotus shell, than say an A frame mk1, therefore they are much easier to clone, so sticking to mk2's may not be the wise decision you think it is.
Tommy
 
So basically if i have been offered this superb mk 1 lotus for £15,000 thats not advertised anywhere, and i think its real,i will have to take pot luck and buy it,because, as its not been offered before, and known to the club, as been locked away for 30/years....if i tell people where it is,i going to have it bought by someone else.
i've learnt from years gone past, not to tell people where it came from till you own it,and at 15k, its very cheap, as long as its real, and as no one can tell me what to look for,i will have to take a chance, but whats 15k compared to 30k for some i've seen.
i'll let my eyes be my guide then.
thx for your help, and hopefully i may have found another long lost car not known for years.
 
You are not making sense 428. If its that secret there no rush and you can get an inspection.

The rush is on on an open market car, and time is the issue.

You are now contradicting yourself.

Regards
FH
 
why am contradicting myself ?
if someone tells you a mate of a mate is thinking of clearing his garage of a few of his classics from years of owning, i'm not telling members of a cheap car to the whereabouts, and yes speed is an issue, as the guy is considering, and may decide to keep...so i want to move fast before he changes his mind, and its nice to find a car know one knows...it has been stored/tucked away since 1971, and is in amazing condition for a 64 car.
but all i asked is how to tell a real "shell" but it seems to be "this top secret issue" only certain members can tell you once they see the car.
you ask me how to tell me how carroll shelby converted his mustang shells, and i will tell you..theres no secretsin the american car world,but this lotus thing seems to be a top secret issue.
i think i will have to do my own research elsewhere, as amate of mines knows a few of the classic racing boys with the real deal cars.
all i ask issome information, but someone must have made the club
"TOP SECRET" PRIVILIDGED INFORMATION TO CERTAIN MEMBERS.
i use to live near delamare roadwhen i was born, and it wern't secret then where the cars were built,etc...but when you want to find out info now,you can't from the club,or perhaps they don't know thereselves.
So istherea genuine memberwho can Pm me how to tell the differences on the shells,or will it remain a secret forever.
please don't decide one day to want an american musclecar, or my imformation will have to become "SECRET" also.
thx members
 
Cobra, PM with the chassis number, I will let you know if it is a LC item, if you want me to inspect it I will meet you at an agreed location and you can blindfold me and take me to inspect the car.
 
428cobrajet said:
we still don't answer my questions, as i want to know,how would i tell a perfect recreation lotus cortina,if someone done all the changes to perfection.
Click to expand...

In theory you wouldn't if the person that created it really knew a genuine car inside out. Alot of people out there know what the Lotus specific parts are and where they should be - but do they know how the Lotus was originally put together? ie what is the correct welding method for each part? Its the detail that normally gives the game away to the trained eye.

If you do have a car in mind why not make use of one of your membership benefits and get it inspected by the club? You can be assured that anything about that car will remain between you , the seller and the club.
 
Hi Rick

Nice one!! like the blindfold suggestion, really is starting to look like a secret society HA!HA!

Regards
Kev
 
I would have thought that if a 1964 car really has been stored away since 1971, the chances are that it is the genuine article.
In 1971 you could still get most if not all the body panels you needed from FoMoCo so unless the car was in a hell of a state then, I wonder who would have bothered to reshell it or then store it for nearly 40 years?
Maybe, but I doubt it.
 
hello 428 if your a car dealer i am sure you can work it out yourself you dont need someone to hold your hand at 15 k its worth a punt ,i buy and sell houses if i were to ask for help i would lose out when a deal comes up grab it

i dont think anyone is going to buy a shell buy a log book do the dame thing up and try and make money can you all get real the dealers wont even make money from it everybody does it for a bit off fun why else would we all do it whether it be a rotter a reshell a remake a clone non off these make money the only one that will make money is the ringer and i would be very surpised if there are any off those guys on here

so lets all enjoy our cars the next time a car comes up for sale why dont we pick out the good parts for a change and be a bit more positive
 
me and graham (flying horse) know of a mk1 lotus up here thats been stored away since 1971!wonder if its the same one eh graham?
 
hello jmcg...at last...someone that talks some sense on here, asall the others think i'm a bit "THICK"
Its not hard to know a lotus chassis number, as someone on here asks for.
the car has not been out, and known to the club, and all this asking to see the car "WHY"
i want to know how to check, and not to ask someone else if this 30k car is worth 15k
but it seems there are loads of differnt opinions to the differnces on bodyshells.
lashman tells me some details,but then tommy mentions double skins chassis parts, and others say front suspensionturret strengheners.
does anybody know, or is this inspect it, and make your own mind up, if the chassis number correct.
i remember the rotten as a pair one on ebay about 6-7 years ago that had low mileage/owners, but he used a hiab to remove from garden, and all suspension dropped out.
what happened to that car ? RE-SHELLED ?
I viewed it, and was the under bidder, but everything you grabbed fell off in you hand.....this was a breaker boy selling it.
Where is it now i wonder ????
i've had cars poached from me, telling where they are,sounless you know where it is, its between me, and the owner.
its nice to find/own a car knowone knows,because all i ever read on here, is he owned that, or he can tell you about that car, or theres a story with that car, so i like unknown cars.
so getting back to earlier conversation, i know all about a-frames/conversions to leafs, after unsafe design, alloy panels, battery in boot, hump in boot floor, but anyone can add some of these on.
its just the important bits to look for, and finding someone on here thats knows, and not think he knows.
AND, I'M NOT ASKING INFORMATION TO BUILD A CLONE/COPY TO SELL FOR BIG MONEY/PROFIT, BEING A DEALER ,BEFORE ANY OF YOU ASK !!!!!!
 
Cobra, I made a genuine, if not lighthearted offer to inspect the car for you, the chassis number not only confirms the car is a Lotus Cortina but what should be fitted to it, if you are that worried about someone nicking it from under your nose then take a punt, but if it has been laid up for nearly 40 years I can't see how another week to get it looked at it is going to hurt, and no I am not going to blab to all about the car, it doesn't work that way.
 
Hi Cobra

I do sympathise with your thoughts about someone wanting to beat you to the car if you let it's location be known and we all know these things do happen.

If I was you I would Just take up Rick's offer, as I can't see you getting a better one, as nobody is going to divulge this info on the forum or it would seem in a PM to you! Take the asking price with you in cash, then at least you are safe.
If it is the real deal buy it there and then so no one else will have a chance to steel it from under your nose, and you can bask in the glorry of how cheap the car was. Then for future reference by observing and asking Rick what he is looking for, you will then have a better understanding about what to look for if you buy anymore Lotus Cortina's from then on.
If it is not the real deal you then make up your mind but at least you know what you are buying and price accordingly.

I think if you carry on with the tone and critisism of the LCR you have used which is at least being very blunt/agressive if not starting to offend with some of the statements you have made so far in this post!! and are adding to the problems of dealers and how we are viewed on this and in other arenas, you are in danger of no one wanting to help you and are going down the route of Budgie when your frustration may take the better of you.

This way you have a win win without all the need for this debate "simples".

Regards
Kev
 
Well I for one tried to help but didn't even get my P.M. acknowledged, let alone a thanks for trying to help, so why should I bother.
428 I don't know what you know, or think you know, but you will look for a long time for strengtheners on the strut tops of a genuine mk1 lotus cortina shell, whoever told you that one was talking bollocks.
If you let people know what you already knew and what you wanted to know, in a civil way, there are people on here who could/would have helped you, but tell me everthing you know about lotus cortinas, or else I will slag you all off aint going to get you any help from me.
Tommy
 
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